New Heavens, New Earth, New Jerusalem ~ All PreMill

My views on the new heavens and new earth are not usually shared by other Pre-Millennialists.  I view the new heavens and new earth as occurring at the beginning of Messiah’s millennial reign.  This new heavens and new earth will be like those that Noah inherited after the flood.  It will be the same heavens and earth, but renovated because of the destruction that occurred during God’s wrath.  My views on the New Jerusalem also seem to be in the minority.  I believe the New Jerusalem will descend to earth at the beginning of the Messiah’s millennial reign.  This bride of Messiah is where believers will dwell during the 1000 year period.  Let’s start with Isaiah 65-66, then turn to II Peter 3, and finish up in Revelation 21-22.  These are the key texts for understanding the new heavens and the new earth.  Open your Bibles, and…. begin!


At the time of the other cataclysmic events of Isaiah, the new heavens and new earth will be created (65:17) along with a new Jerusalem (65:18).  Death will be restricted but not eliminated as people will live longer but still die.  Sinners will have their lives cut short (65:20).  Those who belong to the people of God will have their lives like the life of a tree, long enjoying the work of their hands (65:22).  Animals will live at peace with each other (65:25 which parallels 11:6-9) taking us back to Eden like conditions.


In the midst of this description of the new heavens and new earth, God reminds His people that they really cannot build Him a resting place (66:1-2).  With heaven for a throne and the earth for a footstool, what more could He want from us?  What the LORD really desires is for someone to be humble, contrite, and to tremble at His word.


The people of the earth are called to rejoice with (alongside) this new Jerusalem (66:10).  She will have a glorious abundance from which many may drink deeply from (66:11).  The LORD will extend peace to Jerusalem like a river as she functions like a mother to the nations of the earth (66:12-13).  There is a cause and effect in 66:14-16.  Effect:  Rejoicing and flourishing because the hand of the LORD will be known to His servants.  Cause:  The LORD will show His indignation against His enemies with fire, fury, and the sword.  So, because the LORD will pour out His fury, this flourishing of the kingdom will come after that.  Individual Israelites scattered throughout the Gentile nations will be brought to the holy mountain as a type of living sacrifice to the LORD (66:20).  Of these the LORD will take many for priests (66:21).


The new heavens and new earth which the LORD will create will remain before Him, just like the offspring of Israel will remain before Him (66:22).  It seems like the offspring of Israel regathered at this time are living under the new heavens and on the new earth since they are set forth in the same context.  New moons and sabbaths are observed within the nation of Israel as the entire world comes to worship before the LORD (66:23).  There has been a judgement which has some type of lasting effect whereby people can view the burning carcasses (66:24).


Summarily, the new heavens and new earth, based on an examination of Isaiah 65-66, will be fulfilled in the Messianic Kingdom.  It seems like the Messianic Kingdom, the new heavens, the new earth, and this new Jerusalem will begin as the LORD comes in judgement.  This will be the beginning of God’s plan for Israel to become a blessing to all nations, Isaiah 2:2-4.  This will not be the entire fulfillment, but one step toward the ultimate goal.  This will also be a step in redeeming earth as a whole according to the Seed Promise (Gen. 3:15) in light of the creation mandate (Gen. 1:28).


II Peter 3 concerns the coming of the LORD.  They ask (II Peter 3:4), "Where is the promise of His coming?"  Peter explains that in the days of Noah there was a wicked generation who thought the same thing (II Peter 3:5).  That wicked generation was ignorant that the earth they were standing on and the heavens they lived under were slated for judgement by flood (II Peter 3:6).  Noah was faithful, moved with fear, condemned the old earth, and inherited the new earth (Heb. 11:7).  The same earth that we stand on is also slated for judgement by fire at the coming of the LORD (II Peter 3:7).


The Day of the LORD will come as a thief in the night in conjunction with the coming of the LORD, the judgement by fire, and the destruction of the present heavens and earth (II Peter 3:10).  Because of this, we should have a holy conduct since we know that this fiery judgement will come in such a fashion (II Peter 3:11).  We look for this judgement to occur during the Day of the LORD (Day of God) when the heavens will be on fire and the elements of the earth will melt with such fervent heat (II Peter 3:12).  We look according to His promise [contained in Isaiah 65-66] for that new heavens and new earth where righteousness will dwell (II Peter 3:13).  It seems to me that Paul uses the phrase “His promise” to denote something written in the scriptures which would be a clear reference to Isaiah 65-66.


Laying the two prophecies over each other we see that the new heavens and new earth of II Peter 3 are the same new heavens and new earth of Isaiah 65-66.  They are said to begin with the coming of the LORD, with the Day of the LORD, and when a fiery judgement is enacted upon the current citizens of this present earth.  Those in the church will live in the new heavens and new earth which will be a place of righteousness.


Now for Revelation.  Revelation 20 briefly glimpses ahead to the period in time following the Millennium and following the little season to explain the devil’s ultimate doom.  Then in Revelation 21:1 the emphasis shifts back to the glory of the LORD Jesus at His coming, only this time the focus is on the glory of the bride who comes with the LORD Jesus.  The New Jerusalem is the bride of Messiah having the identity of the twelve tribes of Israel and the twelve apostles both engraved within her.  It will be Israel and the church in one holy union.  At this time God will personally be with His people in an ongoing way, Rev. 21:3, John 14:1-3, Ezekiel 37:27, 36:28, Jeremiah 31:33, Hosea 2:23.


From Revelation 21:9 through 22:5 is a description of the New Jerusalem which descends just as the new heavens and new earth are seen by John (Rev. 21:1-2).  The New Jerusalem will be a city here on the earth.  This description is not a description of heaven.  It is not a description of the new heavens and new earth.  It is a description of one city in relationship to the other nations which will exist here on earth at that time.  I know we’ve all heard about the streets of gold in heaven, but that’s not what the Bible says.  The streets of gold are in the New Jerusalem which descends from heaven to earth.


Revelation 21:24 speaks of certain nations which are saved and walk in the light of the New Jerusalem.  The kings of these saved nations will bring their glory and honor to the New Jerusalem (21:26).  Its gates will never be shut by day allowing the kings of the earth to come (21:25).  While some nations may send envoys to the New Jerusalem, the prohibition is that nothing sinful may ever enter into the city (21:27).  The leaves of the tree of life are for the purpose that some nations may receive healing (22:2).  Within this city there will be no night since God’s light shines continually (22:5).  For those living outside the city, they may be allowed at some point to enter the city and partake of the tree of life, but only if they obey (22:14).  Outside the city there will still be many sinful people (22:15).


This language that the prophet John uses to describe the New Jerusalem reminds us of so many prophecies from the OT scriptures.  Joel 3:17 states that the LORD will dwell in Zion which would be holy and no foreigners would pass through her again.  Isaiah 60:3 speaks of kings coming to the light of Zion.  The gates will never be shut so that kings may come, Isaiah 60:11.  Psalm 102:15-16 foretells that nations will fear the name of the LORD as He appears gloriously in Zion.  Micah 4:1-5 envisions the Word of the LORD going forth from Zion as all nations flow unto the holy mountain.  The similarity in language cannot be overlooked by the serious student of the Word.


Conclusion:  when we read about the New Jerusalem, we are reading about a city here on earth from which Messiah rules, in which the church lives with God, from which Israel is governed, and from which the nations of the earth receive their light. 


Have fun and stay busy – Luke 19:13


-The Orange Mailman

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15 Responses to New Heavens, New Earth, New Jerusalem ~ All PreMill

  1. Kathy says:

    I\’m there too Darrin. That is how I see it now. A question for you. In Rev. 21:12 it says at the twelve gates are twelve angels. We are not given their purpose for being at the gates, but my thoughts immediately went to Genesis 3:24 where God stationed the cherubim after He drove Adam and Eve from the garden of Eden, to guard the way to the tree of life. I\’m thinking these angels stand guard, to keep the unrighteous out…what do you think?

  2. Darrin says:

    Wow Kathy, that\’s a great insight. I hadn\’t pondered the significance of the angels before. But that seems right on target to me. Especially in light of 22:15.

  3. Kathy says:

    It was comparing scripture with scripture (Isaiah, 2 Peter, Rev.) that brought me to where you are also Darrin. And then with 21:9-22:5 all being a description of the holy city itself. With that being the context, not the eternal state, and with 22:3, John\’s statement that there shall no longer be any curse; that would mean any effects of the curse are not inside the city. Then on to 22:14 which talks of who may go in the city (those that are clean) and 22:15 with who are outside the city (sinners, where the effects of the curse remain)…all of those things brought me to the conclusion that the NJ is on the earth during the Mil. When I read about the angels being at each gate I wondered what would be their purpose and that is what I came up with. It\’s been difficult to keep my mind on my VBS lessons this week with all these things bouncing around in my head! I just see it so clearly now… There is one thing however…in Malachi 4:1 – Malachi describes the day of the Lord as coming like a burning furnace. Then he uses 100% words. "And ALL the arrogant and EVERY evil doer will be chaff." So, I see God\’s wrath taking out all sinners. The earth fills back up again with sinners who are the offspring of the righteous who enter the kingdom after the rapture. What do you think?

  4. Brian says:

    Hi Darrin,This is an interesting post. I\’ve considered the possibility that The New Jerusalem will descend to earth during the Millennium. The only thing that keeps me from actually embracing this view, is the description of Ezekiel\’s Temple (Ezek. 40-48), which is clearly Millennial in scope. I don\’t see how the two can exist on earth at the same time. For this reason, I see the NJ as descending at Christ\’s return, but being placed ABOVE the earth. Its actual descent to earth follows the renovation of the earth mentioned in Rev. 20. Let me know what you think.Also, let me know if you\’d be interested in doing another podcast in the near future. That last one we did proved to be a big hit (by blogdom\’s standards, of course). Meanwhile, hope all is going well with you!Brian

  5. Darrin says:

    Kathy, I have a hard time reconciling the judgement at the coming of Christ not being the final judgement. But we know it to be so. We know that Jesus will come, there will be a judgement, but the final judgement will not have occurred. So in looking at texts like Malachi 4, I see Malachi speaking as a prophet. He saw a judgement out in the future and urged his brothers to repent in light of that future judgement. The exact "when" of that judgement may not be known, but the judgement is certainly coming.So in a passaged laden with prophecies to be fulfilled at Christ\’s second coming, should we expect that all the judgement prophecies in such text will occur at the same time? Or should we expect that the judgement will come some time, but not necessarily with these events? I myself see that God\’s Word will be literally fulfilled. This judgement of all flesh will occur. But God in His mercy will allow a reprieve of the ultimate judgement until after the millennium. For those already dead, it\’s not much of an issue. For those alive and living in certain countries, the bowls and trumpets are certainly devastating, but will not bring the ultimate judgement whereby the entire earth is cleansed from every single sinner. Malachi\’s words will come to pass, it\’s just a question of when. Have fun and stay busy – Luke 19:13-The Orange Mailman

  6. Darrin says:

    Hey Brian-Thanks for the comment. I hope you don\’t mind that I quoted your "utopia" post in a recent post of mine. As far as reconciling Ezekiel\’s temple with the New Jerusalem, there would definitely be some issues. First off, the prince (I believe it\’s Jesus) comes to Ezekiel\’s temple, but we know that the Lamb lives in the NJ. A river flows out from Ezekiel\’s temple much like the river of life, but in the NJ it flows out from the throne. Within the city of the NJ there is no temple, the presence of the LORD supplanting any need for such temple. But there will be a millennial temple according to Ezekiel\’s vision. But are these issues insurmountable? Do they create actual contradictions?I believe that the millennial kingdom is hard for us to envision. I find it hard to see myself ruling here on earth with Jesus. What will He have me doing? I find it hard to see Jesus in a role as supreme ruler of the earth or something like that. To me, He is Savior. But we know that He will rule for 1000 years. We know that we will rule with Him for 1000 years. Think of this, if Jerusalem is to be the capitol of the entire earth, if all nations will be in subservience to this one city for 1000 years, how many suburbs will this city proper have? The NJ will be heavenly in nature, but there will be outlying areas outside of the NJ which will be considered for all intents and purposes to be Jerusalem. Ezekiel\’s temple will exist outside of the NJ but here on earth. Our dwelling place will be the NJ, but where will be work? I imagine us getting up in the morning, going out into the earth to do our chores, and then coming back in the evening and playing all night. It\’s fanciful thinking, but what will life in the NJ actually be like? What will it be like to have a resurrection body during the millennial kingdom while the earth awaits its final transformation? I confess that there is much I don\’t know.I believe one of the old school Pre-Millers believed that NJ would be above the earth during the millennium. I forget which one. So you\’re in good company. I\’ve thought about it as a possibility, but I still believe (for now) that NJ will descend right to earth at the beginning of the millennium. As far as a podcast, I really enjoyed the last one. I\’d like to do another. I\’ve got a couple weeks vacation in August which would work out pretty good.Have fun and stay busy – Luke 19:13-The Orange MailmanP.S. I keep tabs with the Anti-Preterist blog regularly even if I don\’t comment that much.

  7. Brian says:

    Hi Darrin, Thanks for the explanation! Yes, I too believe that we\’ll be reigning from the NJ. It is difficult to tie all the Scriptures together, to me it\’s something that takes prayerful study. I appreciate the writings you\’ve made available. I know that a lot of your material sheds light on difficult passages of Scripture. For instance, the much-disputed Gog and Magog passages. BTW, there\’s a twist on that which I learned just recently. But I\’ll wait till we speak again to tell you. And yes, an August podcast sounds great. Just let me know when you have some free time, and we\’ll get it in the mix. You have my email. Also, I don\’t mind your quoting my article at all. That dominion idea is something which I believe will lead many Proestants right back to Rome.Peace & Health,Brian

  8. steve snyder says:

    I believe the NJ will be above the earth but visible during the 1000 years. It will be where all the resurrected saints will have a dwelling and we will commute back and forth by way of cherubs or chariot. The picture will be like that movie, Elysium- visible but above, and it will set down after the 1000 years. It will light a large section of the earth at night through the clear bottom, like in the “gods” walking around on a clear “sea”, in the movie Clash of the Titians.

    The reason it will not be set down yet is fire comes down from heaven in Rev. 20. It wouldn’t make sense if God was dwelling on the earth then- that fire would come down, but would if heaven was still above the earth. The nations will walk by its light, speaks to me of it giving light to the earth during the 1000 years-like a covering.

    We know there will still be seas during the 1000 year reign, but they could be greatly reduced and be fresh water seas (Ezek. 47, Rev. 16). The earth will be greatly changed and burnt ( Isa. 13, 2nd Pet. 3) and could become one continent again. And God will only do this one more time not two, so He does it during the day of the Lord. (Hag. 2). What He does at the end of the 1000 year reign cannot be a wholesale changing because anything Jesus has built during the 1000 year reign will be good and last forever.

    So, mostly done at the start of the MK, but maybe a refinement at the end before God comes down to dwell is how I see it. 🙂 A lot to look forward to! Amen!

    2nd Kings 2:11-12,
    ” 11 As they were going along and talking, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire and horses of fire which separated the two of them. And Elijah went up by a whirlwind to heaven. 12 Elisha saw it and cried out, “My father, my father, the chariots of Israel and its horsemen!” And he saw Elijah no more.
    Ps. 17:10,
    He rode upon a cherub and flew;
    And He sped upon the wings of the wind.

    Notice the singular. I believe the “horses” in Rev. 19 are really cherubs/angels. Angels/ eagles gather our bodies at the resurrection and carry our souls to heaven when we die now, and also bring the souls back at the resurrection/ rapture. ( 1st Th. 4:14) This is what Jesus was getting at in Luke 17: 33-37, where He told us where the “eagles” will be gathered.

    Luke 16:22,
    22 Now the poor man died and was carried away by the angels to Abraham’s bosom; and the rich man also died and was buried.

    Isa. 40:31,
    31 Yet those who wait for the LORD
    Will gain new strength;
    They will mount up with wings like eagles,
    They will run and not get tired,
    They will walk and not become weary.

    Satan is a cherub, but also called an angel. ( Ezek. 28:14, Rev 12:7) So, it seems angels may can take the forms of men and animals-the four faces, Rev. 4, Ezek. 1).

    • “And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God.”

      This is the whole point of the New Jerusalem. You wrote, “The reason it will not be set down yet is fire comes down from heaven in Rev. 20. It wouldn’t make sense if God was dwelling on the earth then- that fire would come down, but would if heaven was still above the earth. The nations will walk by its light, speaks to me of it giving light to the earth during the 1000 years-like a covering.” It may not make sense in our understanding, but this is God’s plan, to come down with us, live with us, walk with us. The Messianic Kingdom will be Christ with us here on earth.

      Of course, God will not be “all in all” until after Christ has reigned and defeated death by throwing it into the lake of fire, see I Corinthians 15:28 with Revelation 20:14.

      • steve snyder says:

        Yes, I agree God will dwell with us on the earth. Yes, for sure! Amen! It is just the time frame of when the city actually sets down on the earth. I see it as not setting down until after the 1000 year reign of Jesus, after the great white throne judgment, when sin is done away with and all enemies.
        I see two different cities and locations forever- the earthly Jerusalem described in Isa. 2 where the house of the Lord is- on the highest mountain on the earth, where we know Jerusalem is now. We read of the same thing in Ezek. 40-48, with more info, and it seems to last forever. So two different locations/countries, but the same renewed earth. Maybe the earthly Jerusalem will be just outside the eastern gate of the HJ?

        Ezek. 43:6-9,
        6 Then I heard one speaking to me from the house, while a man was standing beside me. 7 He said to me, “Son of man, this is the place of My throne and the place of the soles of My feet, where I will dwell among the sons of Israel forever. And the house of Israel will not again defile My holy name, neither they nor their kings, by their harlotry and by the corpses of their kings when they die, 8 by setting their threshold by My threshold and their door post beside My door post, with only the wall between Me and them. And they have defiled My holy name by their abominations which they have committed. So I have consumed them in My anger. 9 Now let them put away their harlotry and the corpses of their kings far from Me; and I will dwell among them forever.

        And we have the heavenly Jerusalem that is a reality now- according to Hebrews 12 and Rev. 21-22. That this is what Jesus was talking about in John 14- seems obvious to me.

        14:1 “Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in Me. 2 In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. 3 If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself, that where I am, there you may be also.

        18 For you have not come to a mountain that can be touched and to a blazing fire, and to darkness and gloom and whirlwind, 19 and to the blast of a trumpet and the sound of words which sound was such that those who heard begged that no further word be spoken to them. 20 For they could not bear the command, “IF EVEN A BEAST TOUCHES THE MOUNTAIN, IT WILL BE STONED.” 21 And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, “I AM FULL OF FEAR and trembling.” 22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels, 23 to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the Judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, 24 and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel.

        So, I believe the eternal Kingdom starts after the day of the Lord is done too-God is not going to shake things again, so it has to start at the Messianic Kingdom. it just won’t be fully implemented until after the 1000 years- when the heavenly city/country will sit down upon the earth. This will be a separate place from the earthly Jerusalem that will last forever. After all, what Jesus has allowed for 1000 years of culture building must continue, or He has made a mistake. Jesus will be getting things ready for the eternal kingdom.

        I think we don’t have the whole plan of God revealed yet either. Like what about Rev. 23? It could be that God is getting things ready for when all immortal believers will be His ambassadors on other worlds? Maybe there are other creatures we don’t know about, or that God will create and then they would be able to come into the city to visit too. It seems God is just getting started and He will use us in any future adventures-as His image bearers. 🙂

      • >>>I see it as not setting down until after the 1000 year reign of Jesus, after the great white throne judgment, when sin is done away with and all enemies.

        If that is the case then why do we read this? “The nations which are saved (meaning there are nations who are not saved) shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honor into it. And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defiles, neither causes an abomination, or makes a lie (meaning that is outside the gate). He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and sexually immoral, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and practices a lie.”

        If sin has been done away with, why does it exist outside the city gates?

  9. steve snyder says:

    That is a good question. My take on it is the “outside the gate”, is the lake of fire that will be burning for all eternity. It will be in place during the Messianic kingdom- and could be visible then? Isa. 66:24, and this is a MK context.

    Like I said before, I believe the nations “walking in the light of it”, could mean they are underneath it and the light of God illuminating the city/country will shine through the streets- which are like “transparent glass”, according to the Bible. 21:21. And of course, the city is not shown as actually setting down at that time. It seems they are similar to clash of the Titans-it looks better in the movie but notice the floor is a clear “sea” of glass and you can see earth.

    If we back up to Rev 21:7-8, we read
    7 He who overcomes will inherit these things, and I will be his God and he will be My son. 8 But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
    We know that it is “lit” when Jesus takes possession of the kingdom because the Beast and the False Prophet are thrown into it.
    Rev 19: 20-21,
    20 And the beast was seized, and with him the false prophet who performed the signs in his presence, by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image; these two were thrown alive into the lake of fire which burns with brimstone. 21 And the rest were killed with the sword which came from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse, and all the birds were filled with their flesh.

    Only after the 1000 years is the great white throne judgment.

    Jesus taught that God is able to destroy both body and soul in Hell (Gehenna) Mat 10:28. That it is in place in the Messianic Kingdom can be inferred by reading Mat 5:22.
    Isa. 30:33 says,
    For Topheth has long been ready,
    Indeed, it has been prepared for the king.
    He has made it deep and large,
    A pyre of fire with plenty of wood;
    The breath of the LORD, like a torrent of brimstone, sets it afire.

    The whole context is when the Lord comes back. That Tophet (h), is the smoldering garbage burning site, outside the city gate- the root of Hell fire- G 1067 in Strong’s. It’s the valley of the son of Hinnom where the people offered child sacrifices to the fire. Hades will be cast into the lake of fire.

    Jer. 7:30-34,
    30 For the sons of Judah have done that which is evil in My sight,” declares the LORD, “they have set their detestable things in the house which is called by My name, to defile it. 31 They have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, which I did not command, and it did not come into My mind.
    32 “Therefore, behold, days are coming,” declares the LORD, “when it will no longer be called Topheth, or the valley of the son of Hinnom, but the valley of the Slaughter; for they will bury in Topheth because there is no other place. 33 The dead bodies of this people will be food for the birds of the sky and for the beasts of the earth; and no one will frighten them away. 34 Then I will make to cease from the cities of Judah and from the streets of Jerusalem the voice of joy and the voice of gladness, the voice of the bridegroom and the voice of the bride; for the land will become a ruin.
    I’m just trying to blend the Scriptures to reduce what seems like contradictions. I too believe there are no contradictions in Scripture, just out lack of understanding. 🙂

    My question to you is what do you do with “no more sea”, and death still going on? And fire coming down from heaven if the city has set down? I too believe the eternal Kingdom Starts when Jesus starts to reign, but you can’t get away from on one hand we have Scripture saying John didn’t see any sea, but we have water going out into both seas (Dead and Med), in Ezek. 47. We also have death on the earth (Isa. 65:20) I choose to see the Heavenly Jerusalem as not touching down until after the 1000 years to help resolve the two problems- along with fire coming down.

    It is clear to me that Ezek. 47 is similar to the heavenly city of Rev 21-22: Leaves for healing, water of life. But in the Heavenly we have the tree of life and we have no Temple. The Earthly Jerusalem has a Temple and there is death of human and animals. I think the similarities are brought out in Hebrews 9:23, as being “copies” of things in heaven. Similar, but different.

    The Earthly Jerusalem will always be the city of Israel forever. The Heavenly city will be a city for all nations forever that may or may not set all the way down on Earth. This being because it is a city and country to itself, I mean it is like HUGE!

    And we can’t get away from this is our city, our citizenship/commonwealth, according to Hebrews 11 and Phil 3. It will be a place where spirits and immortals will be able to dwell together, and in our resurrection bodies we may be able to just “appear” where we want on the earth without the old trusty chariot or cherub? It will be cool for sure!

    Sorry I’m long winded. Great talking about this Orange! 🙂

    Isa. 60:8 says,
    “Who are these who fly like a cloud
    And like the doves to their lattices?

    Could this be us in the MK, flying in the MK???

    • Just a quick reply. Jesus descends to earth before the millennium. Why wouldn’t the bride of Christ be right where He is? All those parables that Jesus told about the Kingdom of Heaven are related to His coming in power and glory. We receive those rewards, those position of authority in His kingdom when He comes again. Notably, see Luke 19:11-27.

      Have fun and stay busy – Luke 19:13

      -The Orange Mailman

      P.S. I don’t have anything intelligent to say about to sea, or not to sea.

  10. steve snyder says:

    I agree, it makes sense to have His/our abode close. Jesus will reign from the Ezek. Temple in the earthly Jerusalem, but will not be there all the time. It would be a small thing for us to not only have a home in the nations (our land inheritance on the New Earth), but also in the Heavenly Jerusalem- which is a country too-even if it did not set down yet.

    I believe esp. as population grows over the years, faithful believers with the right gifts/fit will be ambassadors over/in gentile nations. Some will be good to go at the start I’m sure. And it makes sense that they/us would serving in the areas and nations they are familiar with. I’m not sure if that would fit me, but I know God has just the right place for me. 🙂

    You might be right, I mean the Garden of Eden-with the tree of life was protected by angels/cherubs, like your reader said. And that was-as far as we know, until the flood when sin and death was rampant. The only real problem is about the sea, IMO. But this could be explained by topography changes during the day of the Lord, and we don’t know what “sea” John was talking about. But I believe land will be freed up for more people by not having a sea, and easier access to Israel by the whole world by joining all the land masses again. But that is just my view, and only Isa. 66:18-24 might support it. (Like about 40 days for everyone to make it to Israel? This is how I read it.)

    I too see Rev 20 as an overview of the 1000 years, then the focus going back to the start of the MK, giving us more info on what was happening at the start- in 21-22. Just like Gen 1 &2.
    Good stuff for sure! 🙂

  11. steve snyder says:

    Hey Orange,
    Just got done reading, “What on Earth is Heaven like?”, by Janet Willis. It’s a good read for anyone that is trying to figure all this out.

    She brings out the possibility that the 1500 miles in Rev is the total mileage of the city, so it would be cubed, which brings it down to about 11 miles high-same as it’s base, which is also close to the measurement in Ezek. city- if you use “rods” instead of cubits, which seems to have to be the measurement contrasted with cubits else where.

    She holds to the city as the shape of a stepped pyramid because of all the “copies” of pyramids found all over the world (copied from the tower of Babel, which was copied from Satan because he knows what the city looks like), or it could of been setting down on Earth to start with the people of the first world seeing it, and oral tradition was told about the city and the garden of God after the flood. I agree for sure about it being more of a stepped pyramid, and it does make sense about garden of Eden as always being in the paradise of God- which would be in the city.

    Of course she holds to the NJ setting down at the start of the MK too and the layout with it being close to the Temple on the uplifted plateau (mountain) after the land of Israel is changed during the day of the Lord. The layout is similar to how Israel was before Mt. Sinai in Exodus with the holy mountain of God being close to the tabernacle and people.

    Overall, her view makes a lot of sense because of all the similarities of the Ezek. city with the NJ, the main problem being size. It would also make sense that Rev. was just expanding on what Ezek. taught. Highly recommend you and your readers get the book. 🙂

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